> A.N. Smith sed:
>
> > But updating and substitution
> > occured: the
> > big city for the craggy mountain ranges, the
mansion for the castle, the
> > fear of being watched/pursured, the fear of
death and the dark, etc. etc.
> > And as far as the supernatural elements, I
don't think the key in
> > Gothic was
> > to ask if they were real or not, but to ask if
you believe the characters'
> > fears that they might be real. A lot of that in
HB/noir: did you
> > really see
> > what you thought you saw? Are you really being
followed? Not to mention
> > all the family secret stuff.
Tribe replied:
> I really like this idea. It was never really
important whether the source
> of the dread was supernatural or not. I think in
gothic the source od the
> dread was typically attributed to the supernatural
because something dark
> and chilling was still seen as having its origins in
something "out there."
Well... not typically with the Ann Radcliffe "school" in
which a rational solution generally overcame any supernatural
overtones. But I agree that resolution in either form is not
as important as the attitude and the actual plotting.
Someone mentioned Hjortsberg's FALLING ANGEL -- an excellent
example of a supernaturally-based noir/hard boiled. Jay
Russell has been doing similar things lately with his
character Marty Burns, a semi-PI while struggling as an actor
(CELESTIAL DOGS, BURNING BRIGHT). And Terrill Lankford
deserves a place in this category (but only with one book;
T.O. when are the next ones due?).
Richard Laymon was mentioned in passing. He's usually
associated with supernatural horror, but it really depends
upon your definition. His
"Beast House" series is really an extension of Lovecraft's
"The Lurking Fear" in which the perpetrators, horrendous as
they are, aren't supernatural. Laymon's presented some very
hardboiled attitudes in many of his books -- THE STAKE and
BITE come to mind, either of which is more Joe Lansdale than
Lauren Hamilton.
...Reed (wondering how long Bill D. is gonna let this thread
go on)
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