At 05:16 PM 28/11/2006 -0800, Michael Robison wrote:
>Kerry J. Schooley wrote:
>
>Approach perhaps, but name the others that
deny
>transcendence, please.
>
>***********
>There is no transcendence in tragedy,
In tragedy transcendence is not achieved, but it is not
denied. Transcendence is possible, but for the protagonist's
fatal character flaw.
> none in Gothic,
In the Gothic, at least originally, evil is located in the
landscape, specifically a threatening wilderness or untamed
landscape. It has evolved and adapted and influenced in
several directions, one of which I'd suggest is noir, in
Canada at least, but I think very often there's the
suggestion that transcendence is available through the act of
civilization.
>none in American Naturalism, and near as I can
tell,
In Naturalism there's room for transcendence through the
application of the scientific method, leading to
understanding of our world. I'm not sure about the
Naturalists themselves, but certainly there's a widespread
belief that science and technology and learning about the
world will allow us to transcend our present
conditions.
>the most popular school of writing in the last
hundred
>years, realism.
Yes, and here there's an attempt to transcend by breaking
existence down into its small details and applying virtuous
labels to them. It's a self-defeating concept. For something
to be transcendent it must have something to transcend, so it
may appear that realism denies transcendence, but the whole
idea that, say, work is ennobling is merely the effort to
transcend by adding virtue to necessity.
All of these genres do come close, however, and it is
difficult to imagine we'd have noir without them.
>And since literature examines the range and grasp
of
>human experience, reason, and belief, all those
things
>that you say transcendence goes beyond, I'd
be
>hard-pressed to find the relevance of the
actual
>existence of transcendence in literature. Even
the
>American transcendentalists used their philosophy
for
>the purposes of examining the range and grasp of
human
>experience, so it appears to me that, by
the
>definition you gave, even they didn't do
much
>transcending.
I know. It seems ridiculous but there's all those books about
romance, suggesting love cures all, allowing successful
lovers to live happily ever after. Or stories about noble
knights slaying dragons or otherwise transcending evil. And
the bible, surely at the heart of western literature,
suggesting faith will allow you to live in eternal
bliss.
Bear in mind, please, that the definition for transcendence
isn't mine. The Oxford is a reasonably well respected source
of info, I believe. Mind you, it is me suggesting here that
what western literature is primarily transcending is the
human condition though I've come to that after digging a bit
into Northrop Frye. I'll admit I find reading him tough
sledding. But I'm still suggesting that noir is the only
genre that denies even the possibility of transcendence.
Perhaps the existentialists deny it too, but at least one of
them used the noir genre to illustrate that.
I presume the American Transcendentalists had some reason for
calling themselves that.
And I think you're in trouble if you try to equate survival
with transcendence. Mere survival, with its severe
limitations, is a major part of what we generally hope to
transcend.
There's a hole in the theory, however. Transcendence is
possible, if fragile. We do transcend through imagination,
though noir might suggest that can be cured with a bullet in
the skull. What always gets me is how all this goes back to
the bible. Not that I'm a big fan of the whole God in the sky
thing, but faith and imagination are pretty close to being
the same things, no? If I think or believe I transcend,
therefore I do. It's like they had a pretty good handle on
human psychology even back then, before science and the
rational took over finding the cure for death.
Anyway, that's just me, Kerry
>It is the quest for transcendence that is
significant
>in literature, not its existence.
>
>miker
>
>__________________________________________________________
>Do you Yahoo!?
>Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail
beta.
><http://new.mail.yahoo.com>http://new.mail.yahoo.com
>
------------------------------------------------------
Literary events Calendar (South Ont.) http://www.lit-electric.com
The evil men do lives after them http://www.murderoutthere.com
------------------------------------------------------
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
This archive was generated by hypermail 2b29 : 30 Nov 2006 EST