Hi, all: As you can see, the chart/tree is very much a work
in process so I welcome any and all suggestions. My goal in
the class is that it change throughout the semester.... FYI,
Dos Passos and Dreiser are primaily present to suggest the
influence of the urban novel/"novel of the city." Michael
Gold is an excellent suggestion--thanks!
--- In
rara-avis-l@yahoogroups.com, "Juri Nummelin"
<juri.nummelin@...> wrote:
>
> I think it's interesting, but fails at some points.
I don't think
> Dos Passos and Dreiser had much to do with the
hardboiled novel -
> I'd nominate some other proletariat writers, such as
Michael Gold
> (JEWS WITHOUT MONEY).
>
> George:
>
> > Also, are Goodis and Willeford's heroes
really
> > psychotic?
>
> One might say that about some of Willeford's heroes
(just think
> of the stomach punching scene in THE WOMAN CHASER),
but not about
> Goodis's. She also makes the rather odd connection
between
> Spillane and Willeford and Goodis - what do they
have in common?
> It's also odd that in her system only Cooper
represents the
> Western hero - later Western books surely have much
more in
> common with the hardboiled novel. Cooper doesn't yet
have the
> idea of the lone hero, he emerges later.
>
> I should put the lines of "Rise of the paperback"
and "Crime
> novels/thrillers" under the same label (or
whatever), since I
> think most of the fifties' paperbacks could be
included in the
> line that stems from James M. Cain. Dorothy Hughes
does have
> psychotic heroes, why isn't she in with Willeford
and Goodis?
>
> > I am very curious about her definition of
hardboiled and
> > noir (but aren't we all, always,
endlessly).
>
> Her selections of contemporary noir novel are not
very
> interesting. And her seventies could and should have
lots of
> other folks, too, such as Arthur Lyons, Marcia
Muller, Roger L.
> Simon, etc. It seems now that only Crumley kept the
hardboiled
> genre alive. (I know that it's not necessary to
include all of
> these in the same paper, but the omissions make it
seem strange.)
>
> But all in all nice to know someone else is thinking
about these
> matters, and not just us.
>
> Juri
> http://pulpetti.blogspot.com
>
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