Anny wrote: >So, this leaves me with this thought: Hardboiled is the place where Noir and >Mystery overlap. > >What do the rest of you think? I think it's a futile exercise trying to separate the subgenres of "hardboiled" and "noir" from each other. To begin with, "Postman" was published in 1934, and is contemporary with Hammett, Bellem, Whitfield, Burnett, and any other pioneer "hardboiled" author you can name. Further, if memory serves, and dust-jacket copy on "Postman" calls it a "hardboiled" story--using that word as a selling point. "Noir" is a term co-opted for literature from French film critics who found it a convenient label for certain American crime films of the late 40's-early 50's which exhibited elements of claustrophobia, alienation, violence and sexual obsession; we can easily see those same elements in "Postman," so it's natural to point to that novel as a watershed "noir" novel--although that distinction did not exist fifty or sixty years ago, when it was published. It's my opinion that "hardboiled" (that is, fiction dealing with sex, violence, crime, betrayal and the "lower orders," written in a plain style) and "noir" (ditto, with psychological overtones) are more often than not running in tandem rather than divergently, and neither shares anything but a passing superficial resemblence to conventional "mystery" literature. Jim Stephenson - # RARA-AVIS: To unsubscribe, say "unsubscribe rara-avis" # to majordomo@icomm.ca